This is Bruce Friedman of Adult Site Broker and welcome to Adult Site Broker Talk where each week we interview one of the movers and shakers of the adult industry and we give you a tip on buying and selling websites. This week we’ll be speaking with Alex Ribben of DreamCam. We’re proud to announce we’ve launched a new website at adultsightbroker.com. This attractive new site is easier to navigate and now includes this podcast inside of it. Check it out at adultsightbroker.com. Refer sellers or buyers to us at adultsightbroker and our affiliate program ASB Cash will pay you 20% of our broker commission. This can amount to tens and even hundreds of thousands of dollars. Check out ASB Cash.com for more details and to sign up. And we’re proud to announce our latest project thewaronporn.com. You’ll find articles on age verification laws and more on the industry’s plight in the war on porn and the numerous attacks on us. Go to thewaronporn.com and check it out. Now time for our property of the week that’s for sale at adultsightbroker. We’re proud to offer a premium fan platform comparable to OnlyFans in features and functionality. We offer creators advantages over OnlyFans such as collab posts and a lifetime referral program. They also allow management companies to create an agency account to receive their management fees directly from the platform. Plus the site’s look, feel and functionality are far superior to OnlyFans. This is a growing platform with a massive upside. Most of the traffic is in the US and other tier one countries. There are currently 463 creators with more being added daily. There are over 43,000 users on the site with over 2,000 new users per month. Only $1.5 million. Now time for this week’s interview. My guest today on adultsightbroker talk is Alex Ribbon of DreamCam. Alex thanks for being with us on adultsightbroker talk. Yeah, thank you for having me. It’s a pleasure. DreamCam is setting a new live stream benchmark with cutting edge 6K VR cameras by transforming traditional 2D live cam experiences into immersive VR realities. DreamCam offers users a truly unparalleled interactive experience. Their platform isn’t just a service. It’s a network of innovation, combining a cutting edge live cam platform, a trusted partner for sex like real, VR porn, strip chat and others delivering VR live streams. They also developed their own VR cameras and streaming software. Alex specializes in model relations and marketing with a deep passion for VR and its transformative potential. Try saying that three times. When he first experienced VR, he knew it was more than just technology. It’s the future of entertainment, interaction and digital connection. He loves helping people understand what makes VR so special, how it’s shaping industries and why it’s such an exciting space to be in. Whether you’re new to VR or already a fan, Alex is always happy to share insights, trends and stories from behind the scenes. And I think that’s what you’re going to be doing today, right? Yeah. Okay. Alex, if you had to sum it up in just a few words, what’s DreamCam all about? Well, I would say DreamCam is a kind of a full stack solution. And we are, as you said, we focused on VR experience mostly. And we provide, of course, cutting edge VR technology such as the software, cameras, servers and everything. Basically any VR live cam you see, like anywhere. This is 100% art technology. And of course, we’re partnering with all the major platforms like VR Porns, TripChat, SLR, SexLexerail, Bud-Doying and VRB Group and many others. Interesting. So you guys are kind of the guts behind all of the VR camming out there? Yeah, we kind of actually are. That’s interesting. Okay. What got you into this industry? Oh, that’s a tough one. Take your time. We actually didn’t plan to work with Porn firstly, because we were just developing our VR broadcasting and basically that’s it. But after when we were broadcasting, like some cultural events, we even worked with the Coca-Cola and Google, if you’re wondering. But at some conference in 2018, TripChat came to us and they told us, "Hey, you’re doing awesome VR broadcasting." And then we were just discussed everything out and in 2019 already, the first live stream came out on the TripChat. Interesting. Now, just to understand, does DreamCam has its own platform as well, right? Yeah, of course. Of course, now we have our own platform. So your platform is 100% VR, right? Yeah. That’s interesting. Okay. How about you personally? How did you personally end up in Porn? You were working with the mainstream company at first? No. I mean, before we were started, we started working in an old industry. You personally? No, you personally. Oh, me personally. Yeah. Well, I was just curious about the whole VR technology and how IT can change the world. And then VR came out and I was so curious and surprised how VR can really shook your mind and trick your brain to believing into its real. That’s why I’m a big fan of it. Okay. Very good. So you were a VR user before you came to work at the company? I used it a couple of times. Yeah, I was really curious about how it works. What did you use it for, like for gaming? I got it as a gift for my birthday. Okay. Cool. Very cool. So was there a moment when you thought VR live cam streaming is the future? I wouldn’t say that there was such a moment when we started. It was like a whole process, I would say, because at the very beginning, like no one believed that VR, only real geeks believed in VR. When the majority of people, they were just thinking about VR as a very, very niche technology. And we even have been watching like companies or startups who dedicated their time to sacrifice everything for VR popularization, but not all of them survived, unfortunately. And once who did, they became big corporations. Like again, as I told you, SLR, VR porn, of course, you know who they are. But it was difficult in the beginning. But after, we’re proud to say that we are having 350 plus studios connected in 25 countries, I guess. Yeah. That’s very cool. Has the industry fully embraced VR camming, or is there still a gap in understanding its potential? I think like it’s challenging for us, but for everyone, I think it’s easy. It’s challenging as for a company because VR situations, whole VR situation, it changes every day because now again, some tiny startups who are doing VR can become super huge corporations. And in dream come, we try to maximize the VR technology value, not only us, but the whole VR influence and value. And even I can say that we 100% know that VR is growing day by day. However, we still can understand that a lot of people don’t understand the sense of VR. Like why do we need VR? We have to do it. Why even we need to wear some headset and watch something? Yeah. I think that when you’ve never had it before, when you’ve never really had to do that to watch porn before, then there’s definitely going to be a disconnect, isn’t there? People are just going to go, well, why change anything? Right? Yeah, because they don’t know the difference. They don’t know the whole difference between it. And that’s our main points to show people how crazy it can be that you can do super wild, super nasty and super crazy things at your own house by just using this little helmet. Yeah. And when I first saw VR demoed at a show, I was like, wow, this is really cool. I think this is going to, I hope, I hope anyway, this is going to grow really quick. But I saw some companies, like you said, do okay. And it kind of had a lag time where not a lot happened. You heard about it, then you didn’t really hear about it for a while. Now you’re starting to hear about it more. Why do you think that is? I guess that’s because they dedicated their time and sacrificed something for the popularization of VR. Okay. So walk us through VR live streaming and how it works on your platform. What do models need to get started? And what do viewers need to watch? Again, for us as a company, it might be challenging sometime. But for you as a model or a user, this is super easy. Like not going to lie. If you’re a model, you literally just need to send a request and we will take care of everything without a doubt. It’s not a problem. Then if you’re a user, I would say just find a cozy place and enjoy the magic. And what else? Again, if you’re a model and you’re so curious about how everything goes, how like some things that you can need during the process, we have our model hub, model hub.com with all the information about it. Okay. Once a model inquires, what’s the process? Would you send them and then what happens? Well, basically it depends on what model wants to do because we have pre-recorded content on live stream content. It all depends. But it’s a tricky question. It’s more like technology question. I don’t want to bore you with that. It’s so boring process. Who is forming? Forming. Well, first, a model needs to just send the request to us. Then when she has a camera, she can go live stream, for example. If she goes live stream, she can just be a part of our family, let’s say. But if you are one to just sell your pre-recorded content, you can get, for example, a free post production if it’s necessary. Okay. Interesting. Well, I mean, I’m guessing the model obviously has to pay for the camera, right? Yes. Okay. What does the camera cost? A thousand bucks. Okay. All right. And how do those compare with what some of these VR rigs that are used in the production houses? I mean, how do they compare? How to compare 2D and NDR? Yeah. I mean, the look of that compared to some of these VR rigs that like, Sex Like Real are using and all of that, what would the comparison be between that and the thousand dollar camera that you send them? Because it’s all depends on the variety. Because for example, let’s say you want to play some erotic games or you want to check in the cosplays and it’s all the variety. You can do whatever you want to do. Or like, for example, in VR, let me tell you a story. For example, do you like SMR? Sorry? Have you heard about SMR? SMR. SMR content. SNR, no. I have not. Well, SMR, it’s like... SMR. Okay. Yeah, go ahead. Yeah. It was a story with some SMR content when it was a French kiss. So user just connected with his favorite model. He put the camera, right? He put his headphones somehow and then model was touching her little microphones and giving him a French kiss and it was so, so real. Nice. The sounds, yeah. Sure. You could do a lot of stuff with sound with that for sure. Yeah. So how does VR change the game for both performers and viewers? Is there a kind of magic to the experience? You can’t get with regular camming? I guess absolutely. Yeah. Because you’re not just watching a show or something. You are becoming a part of the show because VR lets you erase all the brings and literally remove the wall in front of you. And when you stream in 2D, you’re kind of circled by your move and you cannot do much. But in VR, like a user, for example, you can choose the POV. You can pick up the right angle. You can control all the backstage. Like, for example, you want model to be at your own house or you want to visit the model at her own house and depends on everything. Like for example, again, just remember, some user wants to become a hamster. Then he connected with his favorite model. Model said, "Yes, okay, let’s do it." And then she put the camera on the little box where the hamsters are doing their things. And the model was super huge on the screen, on the VR. Yeah, absolutely. Again, you can do whatever. Wanted to be a hamster. Yeah, I’ve talked to both in-person sex workers and I’ve talked to cam girls and I’ve talked to other creators who do like OnlyFans. And you hear some interesting stories. That’s for sure. Yeah, 100%, like a lot of super wild stories. Have you heard anything else that stands out that you remember? I remember when it was COVID times. It was some BDSM kinks and it was basically like the whole BDSM show and the user took it to his own house and it is what it is. Interesting, interesting. And you can actually do that with VR. Yeah, because you mean the location or? Well, yeah, I mean just a whole BDSM thing. Yeah, because you literally can change the background, you can control the background and for example, you can be at your own house and see everything you see in any location. Okay. So, for someone who’s used to watching 2D cam shows, tell me about the difference when they switch to VR. What are they going to first notice? Well, in 2D, let’s compare. In 2D, you’re just looking at a screen, right? It doesn’t feel like it’s real, but VR technology literally breaks, I would say, the fourth wall between you and the model and it’s kind of trick your eyes into believing like it’s real. And again, as I told you, you can take the whole BDSM show at your own house and you can still combine because let’s say you came home after a long busy day and your VR glasses are charging, they run out of energy. So you can enjoy 2D for some, a little and then the VR is ready and there you go. But again, as we tell everyone, once you try, you’re going to be shook ASAP because the feeling is super the same, the just in person. Okay. Most cam platforms still focus on 2D streaming. So do you see a day where everyone is doing VR? If you’re a user and you just bought a VR headset, this is super obviously that you go search for some porn. And let’s say now you in Google, you’re seeing hundreds of links, VR porn, SLR and any major platforms you go to, you will see the live cams category on the main page. So that’s where we come in with all the variety because again, for example, you want to play erotic VR games or you’re a big fan of cosplays, anything. So again, huge thanks to our partners like strip chat, desire, so you can surf the web and find any different connection. Okay. But I mean, there’s still holdouts, right? There’s still cam sites that don’t have VR. Do you see a day where they’re all going to have VR? And if so, what’s it going to take to get them there? I guess in some period of time, let’s say like a five years, for example, I think VR headset is going to be as much convenient and as much spread it out as usual glasses or smart watch so in any company that doing cams, they’re going to have to make a whole category for VR at least or even switch to whole VR thing. Okay. How big is your platform right now? How many models are streaming and how many fans are tuning in? A question of numbers. Well, we’re the number one platform to be honest right now. We have more than 14k models accounts in our database. And yeah, and thanks to our analytics, we can provide more than 150k hours streaming monthly. And we have a hundred of models going live streaming daily. And this is allows our audience to grow at least 5% a month. That’s good. Yeah, at 95% of worldwide users, I mean worldwide users of VR porn, they 100% have access to our streams. Oh, okay. That’s interesting. Are your streams being used by the other sites you mentioned? And are the other sites streams available on your site? No, we just have partners because when we were beginning our first stream, let’s say stream, wasn’t strip chat, but now we have our own platform and you can see all our models, all the streams and anything. Okay. So when you first started, you didn’t have your own models, but now you do obviously. Yeah, of course. Of course. Okay. Any models these days are shifting from live streaming to selling prerecorded content, obviously with the whole creator economy, only fans and all of those platforms. Does your platform offer anything for them? Sure. Yeah. We, as you told, we have a models who wants to sell their prerecorded content and the models who are more about live streaming. By the way, three months ago, we launched a feature for unique recorded content. And basically on your camera, you just have a button. And once you press it, you are already recording. And after this recording and after decided to posting it and selling it, as I told you before, every content creator get an absolute free post production. That’s great. Yeah. Because I think this tool, I mean, the feature gets more and more popular and it helps model to create unique content. And even if you decided to film in 2D or you want to stream in VR, DreamCon will provide all the tools to maximize your income and both. Interesting. Are you guys partnering with any of the platforms like only fans? Did any of the creator platforms? As I know, only fans are not partnering with anyone. No, they don’t partner with anybody. But I mean, there’s just for fans and there’s fans Lee and, you know, no, we, we, we, no, we actually, of course, we provide all the tools for your content, but I mean, prerecorded content. I feel more about live streaming and more about connection between the user and the model. Because if you just sell a content as a model, it’s not going to give you this way of connection and bonds with your fans, fan audience, your users. This is the whole different world. Okay. Interesting. Have you found a market for your VR cameras with born producers and not necessarily cam models, but porn producers coming to you and saying, Hey, we want some, we want your cameras. I don’t remember when some producers came to us saying, Hey, I want your cameras. Usually models came to us saying, Hey, we want us, we want to join your family. We want to stream in your site. How can we do it? How can we get the camera? We’re so curious about it. And usually this is how it works. Sure. No, I understand. But I could also see some of the, some of the smaller production companies thinking about it as well, considering that the, the cameras sound like they’ve got some really good capabilities. I mean, obviously a normal VR rig is going to be high six figures. Okay. It’s going to be very expensive. And that’s, that’s why I asked the question, what’s the difference in quality between shooting with something like that and shooting with your cameras? And I don’t think you actually got to that part. Oh, that’s what the question. Well, the whole, the whole difference between the typical camera and our camera, because we have a six K camera. And this, this camera, you can switch to everything again, as I told you before, if you are a fan of porn, you can switch from 2D to VR. And here again, you can stream, you have a live stream when you’re dancing or doing some of your model things. And after this, you can record some content, you can have a post production and then boom, you can sell your content. For example, in IG, I don’t know, with anything, anywhere. Very nice. Yeah. So for after recording content, it’s all depends on you, what you’re going to do with it, but we can’t provide all the tools to maximize and help you. So the storage is right on the camera after they record it. They can download it from there. Yeah. That’s interesting. Okay. So some people say VR camming doesn’t make as much money as traditional 2D streaming. What’s your take on that? And if so, do you see that changing? It’s a tough question. From the one hand, 2D user base is bigger. They’re actually bigger than the 3D and VR. But from the other hand, VR gets more and more popular every day. And according to our experience, user uses both PCs and phones for watching porn and etc. It’s all depends on their location, as I understand. And now VR headset added to those devices. So now it’s three of them. And sooner or later, webcam fan will have all three options. VR headsets are quite expensive. Yeah, it’s quite expensive investment. But at the moment, regularly updated content is, it’s kind of limited. So over time, any VR user comes to realization that only format frequently updating while maintaining high quality adult content. Kind of something like that. Okay. Okay. So AI is obviously changing everything. How’s your company using AI? And do you have any cool new features or innovations in the works with AI? Of course, we do adult companies, they’re paying enough attention to AI, trying to integrate it into their product. And we’re not an exception. We are using AI not only to break the wall, but also break the language barrier. We have such a feature, speech to speech. This technology basically allows a real time voice translation with like a single output voice. Yeah, for example, let’s say I have a model and you are a user and you’re talking to me on Spanish and I only know Japanese, let’s say. And we can communicate super fast and super quickly on different language seamlessly. I speak English and if you only understand Spanish, it’ll come out when I talk, it’ll come out Spanish. Yeah, in a real time. Yeah, it’s like a delay will be like a two seconds, even less. It’s better than the original 2D cams, I think. Of course it is. And we also, we integrating some AI powered background removal for a password. It’s again, as I again, I told you a story when you’re taking a BDSM show to your own house and that’s the whole point of it. So you can basically like not only change the background and it will seem like either your house or any location that you are, it’s in your head. And that’s AI. Okay, very good. Your team recently attended AVN and Xbiz. How was that for your company? Oh, AVN and Xbiz, they were absolutely incredible. It wasn’t our first time at all, the major US conferences. And but still, every year it gets more and more amazed because of the energy of innovation is it’s just beyond the words. The culture, the people, the everything, because everyone wants to talk to you. Everyone wants to discuss some things with you. It’s really big pleasure for us. And of course, one of our main goals on Xbiz LA, for example, was to introduce more US model to the real emotions that user in the arcade experience. They’re super, super big pleasure to talk to all the people out there and just communicate with them and share the ideas, share the experiences. And yeah, it was super funny. Yeah, that’s quite a road trip for you guys coming from Cyprus. Oh, yeah, it’s kind of it. And oh, by the way, we actually had a Holy Rendle podcast. We were guested and Holy Rendle podcast. Oh, very good. Yeah. Yeah, it was super funny. It would be nice if she had me on some time, but that’s another story. And what I recognize that American market is different than compared to, let’s say, Columbia market, for example, a whole different planet. The approach, everything feels super fresh and exciting. Oh, yeah, most definitely. Well, look, any any different place should go cultures are different, right? And you know, obviously, Columbia is extremely different. I’ve had Anthony on a couple of times who puts on the show in Columbia and the LAL show. And you know, he’s he’s got the biggest studio in Columbia. So I don’t know if you guys are partnering with him yet, but if you’re not, I’m sure you will be soon because they’re innovators without a doubt. So I can I can I can put you guys together if you’d like. So for someone who’s never tried a VR cam show before, what’s your best advice on how to get started and enjoy it? It’s all the secret is in communication. Oh, let’s say you had a long hard day and you just got back home. He really wants to relax. You don’t want to do anything. And you have found a great convenient cozy place for the movie. And you think how the VR can surprise myself? How you scrolling our website and you found a model that you really, really like and you would like to to see her. This model is obviously going to be so worth is to you. And you’re kind of thinking why not a blow job? There you go. And yeah, you’re texting. Isn’t it nice that VR VR headsets leave your hands free? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, continue. And yes, so you’re texting a model. You’re saying, Hi, let’s do this, let’s do this. And she agrees, of course. And now you set everything up. You have the camera, you have the like whatever. And in five minutes later, you will forget where the reality is because you’ll be having your favorite model that you have found yourself in our website just in front of you. In front of you on top of you with your with your with your with your dick in her mouth. Even under you wherever, wherever. And again, it’s it all depends on communication. And for example, you can have such a camera position where the model is going to look like a skyscraper is going to be giant soap. Right. And you’re going to be like a tiny. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. One thing I’ve noticed about VR is that you really do. It really does block out everything around you. Okay, you’re not in the room that you were in anymore. Just all you really feel and see is what’s happening in that show. And that’s really the advantage of VR. Yeah, because you’re not just watching it. You are a part of it. You’re living it. Mm hmm. Okay. Where do you see the future of the webcam industry in the next five to 10 years? Do you think VR is going to take over or is something even bigger coming up? I mean, I mean, according to a pace of technology development in VR specifically, we have Apple, we have Mera, we have Samsung, who is giving their investments and power and dedication to whole VR. And I think with all the power, energy and all the sources, VR gadgets are going to really look like a sunglasses like in the five years, let’s say, because as I know, they’re going to become lighter. They’re going to become more convenient because yeah, for now, of course, VR heads that it looks big. So it’s going to be more light, I guess. Well, the question was more about the future of the webcam industry. Do you think VR is going to take over? I guess, yeah, because it’s kind of a future technology and this technology really bonded with camming because you have a camera, you have some webcam show and you have another version of this, which is going to take, I mean, definitely going to take some part of VR users for now. You know, it’s interesting because you’ve also got what I understand you’ve got what’s called AR, I believe it is. So you were talking about it being just like sunglasses. Is that what you’re referring to? Yeah, yeah, I think it’s going to spread out super quick, super fashion, super huge. Yeah, because I think VR glasses right now are kind of bulky and I don’t think anybody likes bulky. I think they like things that are light and things that are easy to take on take off and really the less you notice that you’re wearing them, the better. Yeah, yeah, it’s I think it’s going to come out and end up like a super convenient version of VR headset because of all the investment because all the major companies, they’re trying to invest the money and the power into whole VR technology popularization. Well you guys are going to have to pivot though if they do something that’s actually not truly VR but something beyond that, right? I think yes, but I don’t know what can be beyond the VR. Well maybe a year. Yeah, if there was if there were reasonably priced AR glasses now, would that work with your platform or would there have to be some kind of some kind of adaptation made? I think we can adapt for this or we can even recreate or add another platform and have two for VR and for AR and who has a VR goes to VR. It sounds like you’ve got some pretty good pretty good IT guys, some pretty good development guys and gals there that are putting things together. That’s fantastic. All right. Well, Alex, I’d like to thank you for being our guest today on adult site broker top and I hope we’ll get a chance to do this again soon. Yeah, thank you very much for having me. Thank you. My broker tip today is part nine of what to do to make your site more valuable for when you decide to sell it later. Last week we talked about what information to provide a potential buyer. Here’s more. Tell them what’s special or different about your site. How’s it unique? Make sure and include a list of all the websites you’re selling in addition to any domains that come along with the sale. Is there anything that adds value to the sale? Provide them with any additional information upon request. Before giving a buyer any information, have them sign a non-disclosure agreement. If you use a broker, the NDA will be provided for you. Good brokers like, oh, I don’t know, adult site broker have a large resource of potential buyers that are looking for properties just like yours. And they know how to deal with potential buyers. They’ll also negotiate the terms of the sale, such as price and any payment terms. Before closing the sale, find a good escrow service to make sure that both the buyer and the seller are protected. We have those resources, of course. Let’s talk about some of the factors that influence the sale price of a website. Number one is always profit. It will be a multiple of the profit, and that multiple is based on whether the profit is trending up or trending down, and how fast it’s trending up or down. I’ve seen valuations of as much as five times, although that’s very rare. Normally, it’s in the two and a half to four times area. I’ve also seen valuations of one time if the profit is taking a nosedive. We’ll talk about this subject more next week. And next week we’ll be speaking with Pierre Pignault of MailSoar. And that’s it for this week’s Adult Site Broker Talk. I’d once again like to thank my guest, Alex Ribben of DreamCam. Talk to you again next week on Adult Site Broker Talk. I’m Bruce Friedman. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) (upbeat music) [BLANK_AUDIO]
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